Epic Game

[Dust]

I'm going to be running an epic game in the Forgotten Realms campaign setting. I've got two players already, and I'm looking for two or three more. Post here if you're interested. We'll deal with character guidlines and all that stuff after I've got the players. Just for reference sake, I'm a pretty easy going DM, so if you've got something that you'd like to try out, I'm a good guy to try it with.

Edit: Just to make myself clear, when I say 'epic' I mean using the Epic Level Handbook. Players are going to start out at level 21.

[SponkleofInfini]

I'm in, if not already :)

[Dust]

Yep. I've got you and Skreem so far.

[Talaananthes]

i guess ill throw in.

[Dust]

Rock n' roll. Don't commit if you aren't committed, though. I sense some hesitation. Do, or do not, there is no try, as Yoda says :cool:

But hey, I'm happy to have you if you're down. That leaves one or two more spots. Who's gonna grab 'em?

[Setzer Gabbiani]

what are the stats/gold/etc.?

[Dust]

Gold is standard for a 21st level character (I don't remember what that is at the moment). Stats are the same as in Sponk's Battle Royal game for easy transfer.

I don't know what you mean with etc., but that's all I've decided on for sure. They'll probably be house rules for the martial classes too.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

Speaking of house rules, I have a slight variant concerning the sure striking ability described in Sword & Fist. It states that it strikes as a +5 weapon with the enhancement, as you know. Since only half-martial classes (Bards, clerics, druids -- competent but not focuses melee characters) would use the enhancement, it would likely be a +1 sure striking weapon. Anyway, the variant is that the sure striking enhancement treats as weapon as having and enhancement bonus of +4 higher than the actual bonus. So does it work for you?

Other weapon variants:
-Lower bonusx2 pricing
-Improved weapons instead of replacing (Variant also works with about anything else). Depends on how far you want to go with this one. It can be only enhancement, or go to flaming, flaming burst, fiery blasting or the like.
-Dragonbone weapons have adamantine power and mithral weight (Same variant I use with dragonhide armor). The weapon gains an elemental attack (Based on dragon's age category).
Age Category..............Elemental Attack Strength
Wyrmling-Very Young..Basic
Young-Wyrm................Burst
Great Wyrm+...............Blast

Armor:
-Dragonhide armor has the strength and natural enhancement bonus of adamantine, and the weight, spell failure %, max dexterity bonus, and armor check penalty of mithral. The armor is immune to the dragon's element, and confers resistance (Based on dragon's age category) of the same element to the wearer.
Age Category........Resistance
Wyrmling-Adult.....10
Mature Adult-Old...20
Very Old-Wyrm......30
Great Wyrm+.........50

I know, I keep revising the dragon equipment, but anyway... The basic thing here is that the age category divided by 2 compared to the market price modifier decides the power the item has. You gotta admit though -- a dragonbone heavy pick (Read: Big-ass talon on a stick) can do serious damage on a crit.

Should be last edit: If you can kill the dragon yourself (The parts must be fresh, or they lose the draconic potency), you deserve a weapon like that for significantly less than the normal cost. Unless a gentle repose spell is casted on the parts, they lose their natural magic in 1 day/age category. After that they're just masterwork.

[Dust]

I'll accept the Sure Striking variant and weapon upgrade variant.

The Dragon stuff I don't accept. Too hard to figure out the prices for it, and I don't think the game would really benefit from having them.

For weapon price, I'm keeping it as normal up to a +10 enhancement, and then I'm going to change the price for epic weapons. I haven't completely figured that out yet, and besides, that'll be a campaign issue. +11 total enhancement weapons aren't easy to find, so I'm going to introduce an element into the story that will make them available.

Are you joining up, then?

[Setzer Gabbiani]

I suppose so. Just give me some time for a character.

Edit: Can I take a non-Ferunian deity? I have a pretty good character personality in mind.

[Dust]

Alright, that makes four. I'll e-mail asking for a forum. If I get a fifth, they can join too.

Originally posted by Setzer Gabbiani
Edit: Can I take a non-Ferunian deity? I have a pretty good character personality in mind.

What deity? Because in my experience, the Faerunian pantheon is far more expansive than the base one. There's usually a good equivalent for any of the base deities (Pelor, Wee Jas, etc.).

[SponkleofInfini]

So to clarify character creation rules are

21st lv start
Standard Starting Gold for that level
32 Point Buy
Monster races and templates can be used up to and under the starting level.

A couple of questions;

Can we buy Epic Items with our starting gold if we have enough for them?

Will you be using the Monster ECL's I have set in Battle Royal? If not could you post the revised ECL's here please.

[Talaananthes]

ill probably do some sort of archer, ive been wanting to do an epic archer for a very long time. also, i have a few custom feats id like your opinions for.

Weapon Mastery [General]
Requirements: Expertise, Weapon Specialization and Focus in weapon to be chosen, base attack bonus +10 or greater.
This feat adds +1 to your attack and damage with the weapon to be chosen, stacking with any existing bonuses from focus, specialization or any other source.

Epic Weapon Mastery [Epic, General]
Requirements: Weapon Mastery and Epic Focus and Specialization in the weapon to be selected
This feat adds an additional +2 to focus and specialization bonuses.

[Skreem]

So I've got two characters I'm debating between, both fighter-types.

My lasher character from battle royal was a lotta fun ;)
I've also been working on a ghostwalker... however, without giving away too much, what's the potential for being able to use his primary PrC ability? (The one that's usable against a previous enemy) If there's not going to be recurring EBG's, then the class is really a lame-duck.

[Dust]

Originally posted by SponkleofInfini
Can we buy Epic Items with our starting gold if we have enough for them?

Will you be using the Monster ECL's I have set in Battle Royal? If not could you post the revised ECL's here please.

I'm not going to allow epic items in the starting package on the grounds that you won't have been exposed to them yet. However, I'll be setting up the opportunity for you to buy them pretty early, so if you wanted you could hold off on some of your purchases until that time.

And I figure we can stick with your ECL rulings, except for one. I think dragons are a bit too powerful to be CR +1, so I'm setting that at CR +2. And for those of you who don't know about those rulings, go here: http://www.online-role-playing.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=893

Anything not found there or with a given ECL is still open for discussion. Incidentally, I'm of the opinion that the ECLs in the MM2 are far too high, so those are up for debate as well, with the exception of the Death Knight template, who's given ECL I think is pretty on target.

Originally posted by Talaananthes
Weapon Mastery [General]
Requirements: Expertise, Weapon Specialization and Focus in weapon to be chosen, base attack bonus +10 or greater.
This feat adds +1 to your attack and damage with the weapon to be chosen, stacking with any existing bonuses from focus, specialization or any other source.

Epic Weapon Mastery [Epic, General]
Requirements: Weapon Mastery and Epic Focus and Specialization in the weapon to be selected
This feat adds an additional +2 to focus and specialization bonuses.

Those sound reasonable, so I'll accept them. These are open to everone, by the way.

Originally posted by Skreem
I've also been working on a ghostwalker... however, without giving away too much, what's the potential for being able to use his primary PrC ability? (The one that's usable against a previous enemy) If there's not going to be recurring EBG's, then the class is really a lame-duck.

The campaign is based upon a reoccuring NPC villian, who will likely have NPC henchmen the reoccur (if they survive to reoccur, that is), so the Ghostwalker could work for you. The Lasher sounds like a neat character too, so choose wisely :nod:

[Setzer Gabbiani]

The diety was Frigga. I was planning on a halfling cleric who did pretty much what he could to have fun. Going with the diety's life-preserving portfolio, the only things that really changed his attitude were undead (Takes Sacred Exorcist PrC after cleric), which he would promptly destroy, have a drink, and be happy again.

Are there any FR dieties that mimic this (Can change character race).

Also, can I take the +2 ECL to max stats? I did it in Battle Royale.

As for the dragon items, I change the abilities as needed for any games I'm in/running. It could be adamantine/mithral power, and the item (But not user) is immune to the element.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

Lliira is the closest I see to what I was thinking of. The party cleric, keeping everyone in good spirits (And supplying the ladies with good spirits) unless someone is intent on stopping it. Going straight cleric for it though.

[SponkleofInfini]

I'll come up with a concept soon, I may go wizard again maybe an amped up version of Algerdar form Dagern Travels but without the mutated toad :)

[Dust]

Originally posted by Setzer Gabbiani
...Are there any FR dieties that mimic this (Can change character race).

Also, can I take the +2 ECL to max stats? I did it in Battle Royale.

Here are the Faerunian gods that I think would work for that character concept:
- Kelemvor - Lawful Neutral and the God of the Dead. He is very opposed to undeath, and if you could get your hands on Faiths and Pantheons his clerics can take a PrC based on hunting down and destroying undead. Unlike your typical Lord of the Dead, Kelemvor is actually a pretty good guy. His clerics are not exactly cheerful on the whole, but you could be an interesting exception to that rule. The alignment thing could be a problem though, if you're planning on playing someone chaotic. His domains are Death, Fate, Law, Protection, and Travel.

- Lathander - Neutral Good and the Morninglord who is god of the sun. Very much into birth, renewal and vitality, and hates the undead. His domains are Good, Nobility, Protection, Renewal, Strength, and Sun. He's one of Faeruns more powerful deities.

- Lliira - as you said. I'm assuming you have the info.

There are others too, but I'd say those are the top three.

And yes, I'll allow the +2 ECL for max stats.

[BigRedRod]

but without the mutated toad

Well what's the point if you don't have his toad? :)

[SponkleofInfini]

I would have good alphonze if Dust allows it, I just like that little guy :)

[Dust]

I'll allow it. I like the grotesque little bugger :cool:

[SponkleofInfini]

Dosen't everyone.............and thanks by the way :)

[Setzer Gabbiani]

One more variant question: Since shurikens are weak-ass, and my character isn't going to poison them, can they be enchanted 3 at a time?

[Dust]

Originally posted by Setzer Gabbiani
One more variant question: Since shurikens are weak-ass, and my character isn't going to poison them, can they be enchanted 3 at a time?

I'm not really sure what you're asking. Do you mean that you want to personally make them/enchant them, and you want to do three at a time? Or do you just want them priced in groups of three?

Also, you could just put the Returning weapon ability on a shuiken or two.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

I meant enhancements priced in groups of 3, since you throw them 3 in one attack. Then again, I'm really thinking of changing it to a melee-based character, just to prove that melee can survive.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

New items:

Ring of shield: As the spell. Price 40,000 gp
Boots of Haste: As the spell. Price 120,000 gp

It would be unbalancing at base, so they're priced at caster level 20th.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

My melee character is almost ready. Storm giant/holy liberator (Patron deity Lliira, of course).

It was posted in Battle Royale that the Storm Giant's ECL was +15. To be on the safe side I created it at +17, with 2 maxxor and 2 holy liberator. He has a +40 Fort save.

[Dust]

Mmm... this is interesting. An epic game where three of the four players are using melee characters.

I'm probably going to use the optional rules for martial classes discussed here:

http://www.online-role-playing.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1088&pagenumber=2

[Dust]

Can someone else e-mail the administration about our forum? I did it about five days ago, and I haven't gotten a reply.

[SponkleofInfini]

Pester LeeCHeSSS and he will get to it eventually :)

[Setzer Gabbiani]

I can do without the epic additions that you're offering. A personal thing to prove melee worthwile in epic, as it stands. Also, I was really expecting everyone else to be a caster. Oh well.

[Dust]

It won't apply to you that much, Setzer, because your ECL is so high. Those martial class rules are mostly level dependent, as in, four levels of fighter gives you +4 to your damage rolls and -/+1 for overcoming damage resistance, but 30 levels of fighter would give you +30 to damage and -/+5 to overcoming damage resistance, plus you'd ulitimately get to add +5 to your attack rolls that you wouldn't normally have.

Thus, your Storm Giant, while powerful, won't benefit much from the optional rules.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

Like I said, I don't need the optional rules. I have massive stats and a few spells and spell-like abilities (Chain lightning among them) to back me up. BUT, if you would rather have the ECL set at +15 instead of +17, say so now.

[Dust]

Let's set it at +15. We'll treat your character as not having the optional rules. If you ever want to change your mind about that, just tell me.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

OK. It may take me a while to get the character done with my scedule (Sleep/work/5min. here/sleep/etc.). You said that there were already a few fighter types here. How many are there anyway? They might need magical backup.

[Dust]

Well, thus far you, Skreem and Tala have all hinted at playing fighter types, while Sponk seems to be leaning towards an arcane caster. The party could be in trouble without a cleric.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

In that case, I'll fill in with a cleric. Now for my ECL bartering:

-In the ELH, the ECL for a CR 48 epic dragon is +58.
-This creates the assumption that dragons' ECL is at a rate of +1 per 5 CR (Round up)
-A wyrmling song dragon's CR is 2
-A wyrmling song dragon's character ECL is +3

If this makes sense to you, I'll run a wyrmling song dragon cleric of Aasterinian.

[SponkleofInfini]

That's the ECL I set for Dragons in Battle Royal, I think Dust has set his for CR +2 though. But then that messes with progression as for every 3 HD they gain +2 CR, if it was set at CR +1 then the dragons progression would be straight forward.

But I am not going to argue with your ECL Dust, I just thought I would bring this to your attention. I know I hated everyone arguing about ECL's I had set :)

[Setzer Gabbiani]

Just remember that the ECL presented was for epic dragons. A wyrmling doesn't have spells, SR, or a fear DC. Even after that, the higher dragons still don't completely match an epic dragon. Therefore, if the ECL is balanced for an epic dragon, it's at least balanced for a regular dragon -- especially one without spells or SR.

[Dust]

I wasn't thinking that anybody would play a wyrmling when I set that ECL. If you want to play one, I'd let that go at +1.

But keep in mind you'll have to advance by character class, not by HD, because a dragon's HD is by age.

[Dust]

By the way, we've got a forum now.

[Setzer Gabbiani]

'Net screwed up for a couple of days -- a little late for character.

[WhoNAN]

Dust: Is your game full?

[Dust]

I could accept one more, since I know you're a consistant and solid poster. I think you're going to have to be the last guy I take though, or else it's going to be too much work for me :)

Just check out the Godsbane forum. Between that one and this, you should have all the info you need to create a character, but if I forgot to post everything or if you have questions, just post them here.

[warrior]

im new and would like to play

[warrior]

i would like to play

[Talaananthes]

dude, be patient. the games long started anyway.

[SponkleofInfini]

Yeah, I am not sure there are any positions left anyway

[Dust]

Yeah, I was only letting WhoNan in because he also played in a previous epic game with me. Hopefully you can find another game to be a part of.

[Alucard]

If yall need another guy i might join depends on the level cause i have a level 30 character i made for a Forgotten realms campaign once. but let me know if im not already to late

[Dust]

Sorry dude, no dice right now. I'll let you know if a space opens up.